Disputing Muslim Persecution of Christians


 

London 1940

John R. Houk

© January 19, 2017

 

On January 8th, I posted a Shamim Mahmood submission. Shamim’s submission was a slim rundown on his advocacy as a journalist and Rights activist for his fellow Christians in Pakistan. The rundown is to demonstrate Shamim is a worthy cause to support. Pakistanis don’t make a lot of cash and Pakistani-Christians by the majority earn even less.

 

By the way, Shamim is still worthy of Western aid that is best sent via Western Union.

dresden-1945

First contact Shamim in case he has found an easy way to donate. I like to use Western Union sending money with this LINK to the destination of Islamabad (Contact Shamim in case he has changed cities). Shamim’s email is shamimpakistan@gmail.com, Western Union may ask for Shamim’s phone – +92-300-642-4560

 

A well-meaning Muslim gal left a comment to that Shamim submission politely claiming the persecution of Christians and other non-Sunni Muslims was a myth used to get money of donors under false pretenses.

 

Below is that discussion back and forth between me and Aisha. Then follows a query by me to Shamim about Aisha’s perception. Which is followed by Shamim’s email response.

 

Aisha Khan

1/8/17

 

this is a blatant lie just to raise money, in fact there are Christians in my area and they are very safe and happy with their families. We have good relations with each other, we share our happy and sad moments with each other, we eat together and celebrate together.
This is a failed try to snatch money from people.

John Houk

1/15/17 (1/9/17 @ 9:10 AM & 9:58 AM on SlantRight 2.0)

 

+Aisha Khan Aisha I am guessing you are a Muslim. If my guess is correct, I can make a couple of assumptions from your comment:

1) You are a deluded Muslim with your head in the sand.

2) You are a Muslim Propagandist spreading deceit about the actual brutality of Sunni Muslims against all Pakistani minorities not just Christians (Ironically Pakistani Sunnis also are brutal toward Pakistani Shias & Ahmadiyyas – both of which consider themselves Muslims).

 

Aisha, this blog is full of reports about Muslim brutality against Christians not only in Pakistan but also in other Muslim dominated nations. To allude anything else is the actual lie.

Indeed Aisha, here is a link of the most recent use of the Pakistan Blasphemy Law that is obviously a FALSE allegation against a Christian man:

 

http://www.assistnews.net/index.php/component/k2/item/2524-pakistan-illiterate-christian-man-from-lahore-accused-of-blasphemy.

Using the Blasphemy Law as a vendetta is legalized terrorism, because the accused is imprisoned under horrendous conditions awaiting a death sentence or is suspiciously and mysteriously murdered awaiting the execution of a death sentence.

Aisha Khan

1/16/17

 

+John Houk Absolutely I’m a Muslimah and I’m telling you the truth, there are many Christian families in my area and they are quite safe and happy with their families. They are doing Jobs in various Govt. institutions and also their private jobs. What you are telling me is a different situation and can happen in any country. For example we all know about the wave of terrorism in Pakistan. A large number of Muslims were killed, injured in various bomb blasts and other terrorist attacks. But we can’t blame other sects for this act.

 
We also know that America a Christian country is killing thousands of innocent people including women and children in Iraq, Afghanistan and many other countries. In the name of peace they are waging war on Muslims but we are not blaming Christians for this act of terror.

 
I also know there are black sheep in every community, there may be some misguided Muslims who are involved in such wrong acts but we can’t blame the whole Sunni Muslims for personal act of any individual or a group of people.

 
Also, we have to respect each other’s faith. No one has the right to insult or humiliate other people’s faith. We must avoid such provoking acts which leads to an anarchy and crises like situation.

 
I think this is much worse to use a few events and get emotional sympathies of people to snatch some money.

 
I think this more worse than the act committed by some ignorant individuals.

 
I condemn both of them.

++++

Dear Shamim

 

I have been having a G+ discussion with one Aisha Khan about the last submission you sent to me entitled “Keep Shamim Reporting”. The conversation has been quite polite, but she (I assume “she” in case I am mistaken)  claims your position of Sunni-Muslims persecuting religious minorities in Pakistan is a lie. And quote:

 

this is a blatant lie just to raise money, in fact there are Christians in my area and they very safe and happy with their families.”

 

I read reports from other sources other than just yours; hence, I conclude there is a huge persecution problem in Pakistan. Nonetheless, she seems quite sincere in her belief. Below is the entire discussion between me and her to date on the G+ Community Anti-Islam:

 

 

My knee-jerk reaction is that Aisha is calling you and me a liar. An American colloquialism describes my emotion to being called a liar; viz., “That chaps my hide.” So, I am going to cool off about a day and blog this interaction with some further thoughts from myself. If you have any thoughts between now and the time I begin to construct an edited post, you are more than welcome to provide your perspective

 

+++

Shamim Mahmood

RE: Aisha Khan – Pakistani Muslim

1/16/2017 8:14 PM

 

Dear Brother John

 

I think the World is witness to it that how much Christians and other religious minorities are safe [tongue-in-cheek sarcasm] in Pakistan. The level of persecution is clearly reported and it’s not only me, others have reported as well.

 

Seven members of [one] family in Gojra and a Christian couple in Kot Radha Kishan were burnt alive on false blasphemy accusations.

 

Joseph Colony Lahore where more than 70 houses, including two Churches, were set ablaze.

 

Even today, Christians are treated as second-class citizens and in the [Pakistan] Constitution discrimination is clearly seen.

 

John, she is right that in many areas Christians and Muslims are living together and share their happiness and sorrows, but when it comes to a matter of religion these – Muslims – do not hesitate for a second to kill or persecute minorities.  And especially this kind of (Aisha) people become more aggressive and hit first.

 

Yes, there are broad minded and liberal Muslims but they are very few.

 

I’ve visited her G+ that clearly gives a message of her openness. Secondly brother, you know how much money I have raised, but issues Christians are facing [result in] day by day persecution.

 

Thanks now I’m going to take tea.

 

God bless you,

 

Shamim

+++

A Few Thoughts to Aisha’s 1/16/17

January 19, 2017

John R. Houk

 

Aisha wrote:

 

We also know that America a Christian country is killing thousands of innocent people including women and children in Iraq, Afghanistan and many other countries. In the name of peace they are waging war on Muslims but we are not blaming Christians for this act of terror.

 

Aisha consider the facts behind these quotes:

 

Thirty civilians have been killed in northern Afghanistan during an Afghan special forces mission supported by Nato, an Afghan spokesman says.

 

Provincial officials say many of the deaths were caused by Nato air strikes.

 

The air support was called in after troops were surrounded by Taliban militants, who took shelter in civilian homes, the spokesman said.

 

 

“US forces conducted strikes in Kunduz to defend friendly forces. All civilian casualty claims will be investigated,” the Nato-led Resolute Support mission said.

 

 

A further 25 civilians were wounded in the operation in Kunduz, Mr Danish said, and 26 Taliban fighters were killed, including two commanders. The Taliban say only three of their fighters were killed.

 

US soldiers killed

 

The US military said its soldiers died after coming under fire during a mission to clear a Taliban position.

 

Two other US soldiers were wounded, it said. General John Nicholson said the soldiers’ loss was “heartbreaking”.

 

Taliban fighters came close to overrunning Kunduz city last month and the security situation in the area remains febrile. The insurgents control large areas of the province around the city.

 

US combat operations against the Taliban officially ended in 2014 but special forces have continued to provide support to Afghan troops.

 

Afghan forces have suffered thousands of casualties, with more than 5,500 killed in the first eight months of 2016. READ ENTIRETY (Afghanistan Nato: ’30 civilians killed’ during Taliban fighting; By Reuters; BBC; 11/3/16)

 

And more …

 

The war in Afghanistan continues destroying lives, due to the direct consequences of violence and the war-induced breakdown of public health, security, and infrastructure. Civilians have been killed by crossfire, improvised explosive devices (IEDs), assassinations, bombings, and night raids into houses of suspected insurgents. Even in the absence of fighting, unexploded ordnance from previous wars and United States cluster bombs continue to kill.

 

 

About 104,000 people have been killed in the Afghanistan war since 2001. More than 31,000 of those killed have been civilians. An additional 41,000 civilians have been injured since 2001. READ ENTIRETY (AFGHAN CIVILIANS; WATSON INSTITUTE FOR INTERNATIONAL AND PUBLIC AFFAIRS)

 

And more …

 

ISLAMABAD, PAKISTAN — A joint military operation in northern Afghanistan in early November killed 33 Afghan civilians and wounded 27, the U.S. military said Thursday in releasing details of its investigation into the incident.

 

The attack in Boz village in restive Kunduz province flattened dozens of houses, residents and Taliban insurgents said. The joint operation was conducted to capture Taliban leaders who were plotting to seize the provincial capital of Kunduz, Afghan and U.S. military officials said.

 

“To defend themselves and Afghan forces, U.S. forces returned fire in self-defense at Taliban who were using civilian houses as firing positions,” U.S. military officials said.

 

 

Afghan special forces had planned the raid against the Taliban hideout in Kunduz with the help of a small group of American military advisers. But the insurgents swiftly engaged them, opening fire from multiple civilian buildings, the U.S. military said in its investigation. [Blog Editor: Emphasis Mine]

 

“U.S. and Afghan forces were forced to request aerial fire support from U.S. platforms in self-defense. Aerial fires were also used to suppress Taliban who were firing on U.S. medical evacuation assets as the dead and wounded were evacuated,” it said. READ ENTIRETY (US Confirms Airstrike Killed 33 Afghan Civilians in Kunduz; By Ayaz Gul; VOA; Last Updated 1/12/17 7:29 PM)

 

In Iraq …

 

Another person said: “Before blaming Muslims for Isis, remember that Isis terrorist attacks is targeting more Muslims than any other groups.”

 

Many people were sharing an image bearing the slogan: “Isis is bombing Muslims in Muslim countries in the holy month of Ramadan. And you still say Isis represents Islam?”

 

 

Like in other recent attacks, Isis’ initial propaganda claim said it targeted a “gathering of the Popular Mobilisation” Committees – predominantly Shia armed groups fighting its militants alongside Iraqi security forces.

 

But authorities say there were many women and children among the civilian victims, and a later statement from the organisation made it clear religion was the target, saying: “The raids of the mujahedeen [holy warriors] against the Rafidha [Shia] apostates will not stop.”

 

 

Shias were also the main victims of Isis’ deadliest ever attack in Iraq, when militants massacred 670 prisoners in a raid in Badush in June 2014.

 

A handful of survivors recounted jihadists separating Shias and other religious minorities, driving them into the desert and lining them up on the edge of a ravine before opening fire with machine guns.

 

There are no definitive figures on the number of Muslims or other religious denominations killed by Isis but the huge number of Iraqi victims, where 99 per cent of the population is Muslim, suggests that the religion makes up by far the largest proportion of the dead. READ ENTIRETY (Baghdad bombing: Iraqis remind world that most of Isis’ victims are Muslims after more than 160 killed; By Lizzie Dearden; Independent; 7/5/16)

 

American involvement in Iraq …

 

 

The rate of Iraqi civilian deaths caused by US-led coalition forces has declined steadily from 2009, while the rate caused by Iraqi state forces has increased, with deaths resulting directly from actions involving US-led coalition forces falling to their smallest number ever, at a total of 19 reported by year end (down from 32 in 2010), and deaths involving Iraqi forces rising from 98 in 2010 to 147 in 2011.

 

 

Total deaths with combatants, combining IBC and official records:

 

Combining IBC civilian data with official Iraqi and US combatant death figures and data from the Iraq War Logs released by WikiLeaks, we estimate the documented death toll across all categories since March 2003 to be 162,000, of whom 79% were civilians.

 

Most deadly period of violence:

 

Iraq’s violence peaked in late 2006 but was sustained at high levels until the second half of 2008 – nearly 90% of the deaths occurred by 2009.

 

Weapons claiming the most victims:

graph-weapons-claiming-the-most-victims

 

Civilians killed by Gunfire Explosives Air attacks 2003 – 2011 by quarter Download data

 

64,575 of the civilian dead were reported killed by small arms gunfire; 39,273 by explosive weapons (such as IEDs, suicide attacks, and aerial bombardment); and 5,820by airstrikes (including cannon-fire, bombs and missiles).

 

Children killed:

 

Of the 45,779 victims for whom IBC was able to obtain age data, 3,911 (8.54%) were children under age 18.

 

Most-targeted group:

 

Police forces have been a major target, with 9,609 deaths reported – by far the largest toll of any professional group.

 

 

Civilians killed by US-led coalition

 

US forces killed far more Iraqi civilians than any other members of the US-led coalition, including various Iraqi military forces acting with or independently of them.3 The data on US forces killings show:

 

Total deaths from coalition forces:

 

15,141 (13%) of all documented civilian deaths were reported as being directly caused by the US-led coalition.

 

Children killed by coalition forces:

 

Of the 4,040 civilian victims of US-led coalition forces for whom age data was available, 1,201 (29%) were children.

 

 

  • Iraq Body Count 2003-2011 — 114,212

 

  • Iraq War Logs new ‘Civilian’ and comparable ‘Host Nation’ remaining – central estimate — 13,750

 

  • Iraq War Logs ‘Host Nation’ combatant – central estimate — 5,575

 

  • Iraq War Logs ‘Enemy’ (minus IBC overlaps) – central estimate — 20,499

 

  • Insurgents killed June-December 2003 — 597

 

  • Insurgents killed May 2004 — 652

 

  • Insurgents & Iraqi soldiers killed March 2009 — 59

 

  • Insurgents & Iraqi soldiers killed 2010–2011 – 2,187

 

  • TOTAL IRAQI — 157,531

 

  • US & Coalition military killed 2003–2011 — 4,802

 

  • TOTAL — 162,333

 

Official statistics

 

Official figures released monthly by Iraqi ministries continue to be lower than IBC’s, as in previous years, and this year more so than last. 7 However, longer-term official figures released in 2009 by the Iraqi Ministry of Human Rights show somewhat higher totals than IBC for 2004-6. This indicates, as does the WikiLeaks-published US military database, that a full accounting for the entire period from 2003 will be above, not below, IBC’s present count. Unfortunately official Iraqi data is presented in aggregate form, whereas IBC’s numbers are obtained from incidents individually listed on its website. This not only makes them open to public scrutiny for verification or amendment, but would allow item-by-item cross-referencing against other, similarly detailed sources.

 

READ ENTIRETY (Iraqi deaths from violence 2003–2011; Iraq Body Count; First published 1/2/12)

 

Aisha the reality about war is this: WAR IS HELL.

 

The history of war demonstrates civilians – innocent and not so innocent sympathizers to the enemy – is an inevitable reality. When you say Americans kill civilian men, women and children, it is a true statement. BUT it is also true that not only have Muslims killed Christians and other religious minorities in in Muslim dominated populations, they have killed themselves.

 

One thing to consider in Aisha’s concerns about civilian deaths by American hands IS THIS: The United States of America would not have invaded Afghanistan if the Taliban government had not stood by Usama bin Laden and al Qaeda after about 3,000 (plus) civilians on American soil with hijacked jet airliners on September 11, 2001 (WE call that cowardly infamous day “911”). If that attack had never occurred on American soil, our military would never have invaded Afghanistan. And if we never invaded Afghanistan, it is unlikely the U.S. would have invaded Iraq based on rumors of Weapons of Mass Destruction being manufactured by Saddam Hussein.

 

Aisha on a personal note I have to ask: What makes you think Christians and Jews can live continuously in peace side by side? Are you not aware that your prophet Muhammad’s last words in the Quran was to kill Christians and Jews? According Islamic theology, Muhammad’s last words abrogate any previous words of peace toward those he called the People of the Book.

 

Do you hear without cringing the Church bells ringing calling Christians to assemble and worship God openly and with loud reverence? How many Jewish Synagogues operate openly in Pakistan or any Muslim dominated society? What happens in Pakistan if a Christian publicly announces Jesus Christ is the Son of God and the only path to Salvation from a Satan dominated world? You have to realize a Christian not brainwashed by centuries of Islamic Supremicism would tell a Muslim that Muhammad was a false prophet for claiming Jesus was not the Son of God?

 

If you want more trust from Americans that consider themselves Christians and/or Jews, Muslim must reform their theology to not condemn others for blaspheming Islam. Just as Christians in America not knowing just how intolerant Islam is, are more than willing to accept a Mosque, Synagogue, Buddhist Temple or even a brainwashing religious cult to be on the same street as a Church. Christians may not like the idea and perhaps protest such a building that denies Christ as the Son of God, but Christians would not riot en masse over the situation resulting assault, property damage or murder.

 

Something to think about Aisha next time your news tells your peaceful Muslim/Christian community that Christians were slaughtered because they may have offended the Quran, Islam, Allah or Muhammad.

 

JRH 1/19/17

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Author: oneway2day

I am a Neoconservative Christian Right blogger. I also spend a significant amount of time of exposing theopolitical Islam.

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